Do you think people are born gay?

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Re: Do you think people are born gay?

Unread postby acpro » 11 May 2013, 01:18

acpro wrote:I think we are born gay but I hope not. Once a gay gene is located will parents search for it, and then abort their children if they are going to be gay?

We could be the last of our kind...


Can we talk about this more... could we be extinct if there is actually a gay gene?
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Re: Do you think people are born gay?

Unread postby Lucas » 11 May 2013, 01:34

Dude they would never let gays go extinct. Who would be the fashion designers and interior decorators? The hair dressers and male flight attendants? Whether the establishment will it admit it or not, they need gays.
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Re: Do you think people are born gay?

Unread postby acpro » 11 May 2013, 02:14

Lucas wrote:Dude they would never let gays go extinct. Who would be the fashion designers and interior decorators? The hair dressers and male flight attendants? Whether the establishment will it admit it or not, they need gays.


But if people are truly born gay, and not just genetically predispositioned (which I sort of lean towards actually), then parents could see that and then abort and eventually maybe even intervene genetically prior to birth or even conception.

I love being gay and I wouldn't want it any other way, but do straight parents feel the same way? Even liberal ones?
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Re: Do you think people are born gay?

Unread postby Josiemonster » 11 May 2013, 07:43

acpro wrote:
Lucas wrote:Dude they would never let gays go extinct. Who would be the fashion designers and interior decorators? The hair dressers and male flight attendants? Whether the establishment will it admit it or not, they need gays.


But if people are truly born gay, and not just genetically predispositioned (which I sort of lean towards actually), then parents could see that and then abort and eventually maybe even intervene genetically prior to birth or even conception.

I love being gay and I wouldn't want it any other way, but do straight parents feel the same way? Even liberal ones?

The newer generation are more accepting. They wouldn't abort. I certainly wouldn't if I found out my child had the 'gay gene' I know for 100% certainty that my brother wouldn't either.
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Re: Do you think people are born gay?

Unread postby Edward » 11 May 2013, 18:17

Surely the type of people who would abort their child for being homosexual would also be against abortion and genetic intervention for that matter too? And any responsible government won't allow genetic intervention for conditions that aren't considered dangerous. The key word being responsible of course.
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Re: Do you think people are born gay?

Unread postby Upsidedownorangejuice » 12 May 2013, 05:23

Personaly i was born i knew by the second dude i thought asexual, i had nothing to lose and bam second dude i had physical loving contact (this i after several crushes on dudes) i knew i just knew
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Re: Do you think people are born gay?

Unread postby teperg » 15 May 2013, 18:22

Josiemonster wrote:Do you think people are born gay? Or do you think it's environmental factors?

Can someone 'turn' gay?


Personally, I don't think it even really matters. There's plenty of reason to believe both sides of the argument, so I just say people should be who they want to be. That's just my opinion though.
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Re: Do you think people are born gay?

Unread postby Odinson » 15 May 2013, 18:44

I, personally, don't believe i was born gay. I think sexual identity is something you develope later in life, i mean, as a child you are essentially an asexual creature. I had no feelings one way or the other until i was about 12/13. That being said some boys are obviously born a little more effeminate than most but IMO that is probably something that sways them towards a gay lifestyle rather than being a direct cause of some 'gay gene'.
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Re: Do you think people are born gay?

Unread postby gavjg » 15 May 2013, 20:23

teperg wrote:
Josiemonster wrote:Do you think people are born gay? Or do you think it's environmental factors?

Can someone 'turn' gay?


Personally, I don't think it even really matters. There's plenty of reason to believe both sides of the argument, so I just say people should be who they want to be. That's just my opinion though.


Yes I totally agree with you
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Re: Do you think people are born gay?

Unread postby Josiemonster » 16 May 2013, 21:02

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Re: Do you think people are born gay?

Unread postby ryshak » 17 May 2013, 09:50

I think, people are born being gay or straight. It is just the way it is. It doesn't depend on us.
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Re: Do you think people are born gay?

Unread postby Josh » 18 May 2013, 12:26

Sexuality forms part of your identity, which isn't something you're born with. You don't emerge on day one with everything predetermined for you... you grow to discover your preferences towards everything in life from your favourite colour, to your favourite food, and yes to your preferred gender/s.

As such, I don't believe we're born gay. But then neither do I believe that heterosexuality is the default sexuality we're born with either. Notice the similarities in these statements...

I'm not born with my favourite colour being red, as it's something that I come to determine once I've been subjected to the colour red.

I'm not born being gay, as it's something that I come to determine once I've been subjected to sexual or romantic experiences.


I use colour preferences as an example, as my favourite colour used to be blue. As a young child it was yellow. Earlier than that, I couldn't give a fuck about what my favourite colour was, but it was okay for me to accept a change in my preferences as time went by. To this effect, I can't take the 'born gay' argument seriously and think it cringe-worthy when a gay person uses that as an unwarranted defence of their sexual preference.
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Re: Do you think people are born gay?

Unread postby Bookface » 19 May 2013, 15:40

Define gay. Do we include bisexual people? People who are 1,2,4 and 5 on the Kinsey scale? Do we include people who are transgendered?

I'd say that from my own perspective that this wasn't something that was a conscious decision. But if we're to assume that every male who is attracted to other men has this experience in the exact same way, we're making a whole lot of assumptions here. There's a good chance that there are multiple forms of homosexuality, with different causes. Studies have indicated that homosexuality can be related to the prevalence of certain pre-natal hormones, a resistance to certain hormones, epigenetics, chromosome structure, variations in brain structure, variations in chemical responses in the brain, gender non-conformity in early childhood, the number of siblings, the fertility of siblings; and that's just talking about male gender-aligned homosexuality. It's not clear how and if these different factors relate, and in almost every study the gay sample group only showed around an 80% alignment with the given 'symptoms'.

Its like asking what makes people tall. Is it genetic? Is it diet? Well, its both. And it could be any number of genetic and diet factors. There's malnutrition, growth hormone deficiency, organ failure, drugs, chromosomal deletions, inherited diseases, birth defect syndromes, bone structures fusing earlier than intended, turner syndrome, chronic renal insufficiency, Prader–Willi syndrome, limited exposure to sunlight, achondroplasia, spondyloepiphyseal dysplasia congenita, diastrophic dysplasia, pseudoachondroplasia, hypochondroplasia, Noonan syndrome, primordial dwarfism, osteogenesis imperfecta, hypothyroidism or a faulty pituitary gland. Also you might also have just had short parents.

TLDR: Are people born gay? Yes... and no. Welcome to the world of humanity, made up of 7 billion very different, very individual people, and a few thousand statisticians doing their best to overlook that fact.

Luv,
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Re: Do you think people are born gay?

Unread postby Paragon » 22 May 2013, 05:31

Szazomy wrote:Sexuality forms part of your identity, which isn't something you're born with. You don't emerge on day one with everything predetermined for you... you grow to discover your preferences towards everything in life from your favourite colour, to your favourite food, and yes to your preferred gender/s.

As such, I don't believe we're born gay. But then neither do I believe that heterosexuality is the default sexuality we're born with either. Notice the similarities in these statements...

I'm not born with my favourite colour being red, as it's something that I come to determine once I've been subjected to the colour red.

I'm not born being gay, as it's something that I come to determine once I've been subjected to sexual or romantic experiences.


I use colour preferences as an example, as my favourite colour used to be blue. As a young child it was yellow. Earlier than that, I couldn't give a fuck about what my favourite colour was, but it was okay for me to accept a change in my preferences as time went by. To this effect, I can't take the 'born gay' argument seriously and think it cringe-worthy when a gay person uses that as an unwarranted defence of their sexual preference.

Sexuality as a whole is different from sexual orientation, though.
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Re: Do you think people are born gay?

Unread postby Josh » 22 May 2013, 10:55

Apollo wrote:
Szazomy wrote:Sexuality forms part of your identity, which isn't something you're born with. You don't emerge on day one with everything predetermined for you... you grow to discover your preferences towards everything in life from your favourite colour, to your favourite food, and yes to your preferred gender/s.

As such, I don't believe we're born gay. But then neither do I believe that heterosexuality is the default sexuality we're born with either. Notice the similarities in these statements...

I'm not born with my favourite colour being red, as it's something that I come to determine once I've been subjected to the colour red.

I'm not born being gay, as it's something that I come to determine once I've been subjected to sexual or romantic experiences.


I use colour preferences as an example, as my favourite colour used to be blue. As a young child it was yellow. Earlier than that, I couldn't give a fuck about what my favourite colour was, but it was okay for me to accept a change in my preferences as time went by. To this effect, I can't take the 'born gay' argument seriously and think it cringe-worthy when a gay person uses that as an unwarranted defence of their sexual preference.

Sexuality as a whole is different from sexual orientation, though.


Then start what I said with 'Sexual orientation' rather than 'Sexuality', and it still reaches the same conclusion I think :nod: :)
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Re: Do you think people are born gay?

Unread postby poolerboy0077 » 22 May 2013, 23:54

Szazomy wrote:Sexuality forms part of your identity, which isn't something you're born with. You don't emerge on day one with everything predetermined for you... you grow to discover your preferences towards everything in life from your favourite colour, to your favourite food, and yes to your preferred gender/s.

It could be the case that sexual orientation isn't entirely innate but your explanation here I don't think is very good.

Consider puberty by analogy. No one is born pubescent; it takes years before we finally hit that stage of our lives. Yet no one would ever conclude that puberty isn't entirely innate simply because we're not born into it.
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Re: Do you think people are born gay?

Unread postby Josh » 23 May 2013, 01:08

poolerboy0077 wrote:It could be the case that sexual orientation isn't entirely innate but your explanation here I don't think is very good.

Consider puberty by analogy. No one is born pubescent; it takes years before we finally hit that stage of our lives. Yet no one would ever conclude that puberty isn't entirely innate simply because we're not born into it.


Fair enough, the explanation isn't great. Mine never are :P

I'm personally inclined to believe that sexual orientation is determined by a mix of biological and psychological factors, but I don't know if there are sufficient indicators that the human mind is capable of such developed psychology at birth that sexual orientation could be predetermined so early on.
Whilst I'm happy for it to be proved otherwise (it's nothing more than my personal opinion), there are supportive correlations that being subjected to particular lifestyles or circumstances can contribute to a greater likelihood of being gay (i.e. homosexuality in males is more common in single-parent circumstances where the biological father is absent). Are we to believe that under different life circumstances that gay individuals would always possess the same sexual orientation?
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Re: Do you think people are born gay?

Unread postby Paragon » 23 May 2013, 01:23

Gender role is more likely to be affected by nurture. You sort of have to ask, for example with your... example, how much of that is the kid actually being gay or straight, and how much of it is his willingness to come out and/or or actually act on his orientation?
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Re: Do you think people are born gay?

Unread postby David3000 » 23 May 2013, 03:43

delete
Last edited by David3000 on 4 September 2015, 22:08, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: Do you think people are born gay?

Unread postby Paragon » 23 May 2013, 04:00

david3000 wrote:lots of people turn gay after they got raped as children or after they've been in jail,

None of this is true.
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