Idea of LGBT State and Queer nation creation

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Re: Idea of LGBT State and Queer nation creation

Unread postby PopTart » 3 October 2021, 09:28

Derek wrote:This whole discussion is inane.
You chose to wade in Derek, you chose to argue the toss, your always welcome to pick up your toys and go play someplace else. Jeez.

Derek wrote:Our actions only make things worse.
Tell that to the people, who were so desperate not to find themselves, once again under Taliban rule, that they were willing to risk their lives and cling to the underside of aircraft as they took off from the runway. Talk about myopic.

Maybe tell that to young gay men, who now hide in their homes, afraid to go outside, who risked their lives everyday to send text messages on their phones to people they once could freely love.

Tell that to the innumerable women who were able to become writers, artists, free thinkers, who are once again being consigned to antiquated gender roles by a dogmatic, religiously motivated authoritarian regime.

Derek wrote:We - your country, my country, the Soviets - created the Taliban.
A vile culture created the Taliban. Many other nations have been invaded over the centuries and haven't become backwards, soul crushing nightmares as a result.
Derek wrote:Our only responsibility is to leave and stay gone.
That may be your opinion, you are entitled to it. If you only would let me be entitled to mine.

Do me a favour Derek, go back to ignoring me please, it will be no skin off my nose, since the only time you do engage, is to take me to task for my opinions, sneer and to be an arsehole. I have no interest in repeating this pattern of hostility, life is too short and our interactions aren't worth it. There is nothing to salvage here.
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Re: Idea of LGBT State and Queer nation creation

Unread postby PopTart » 3 October 2021, 09:30

Derek wrote:One other thing

Poptart wrote:trust an American to speak of Shah Reza like they are an authority. Many secular Iranians who fled to the UK after the American backed coup by the Ayatollah, speak of the bitter regret and lost opportunity that died with Reza Shah being ousted from power.

I'm not an authority on that topic, but at least I know the Iranian Revolution wasn't an "American backed coup by the Ayatollah". Jesus Christ.

The CIA's interference is well documented and was instrumental in the rise of the Ayatollah.
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Re: Idea of LGBT State and Queer nation creation

Unread postby Simple-user » 3 October 2021, 20:23

Wouldn't you mind if I make a space break during your hot military conversations? )



About the Moon: I have read on Internet about possibility to generate a water from windy streams, and I think we are already has this technology. And about consider the Moon as the space hub - theoretically it could be possible with oxygen and water generation, but quite big problem in what we don't have the ability to build space buildings from a printer, and the main problem - we don't have gravitation control technology. With these two technologies would be possible to build moon buildings which would be super strong due to the high precision of perfectionism that would be incorporated into the construction printer; plus with successful gravity. Bases and cities would be built very quickly - by leaps and bounds\by 7 miles steps.



About space stations - this is very wonderfull conception: air viruses filtration, air humidity control, climate control, zero cataclysms, increased perfectionism for urban planning. It is also culinary and floristic diversity due to the biodiversity of the resource oxygen planets. But also this is expensive project and it's good - the more invested in the project, the more return will be.



Cheaper variant would be in an oxygen planet research, I mean in a planet which is fully prepared for use, and which has endless oxygen. Because, at the moment, human space research without aliens' mentoring is like throwing space parts on the moon, Mars or wherever it goes. And if people are really has labs which can detect aliens activity, so I suppose, aliens, with their own labs, are laugh\cackle at us - watching as we independently try to conquer space. But, we could laugh with them about ourselves )



For example, regarding International Space Station, I think that the astronauts there, instead of enjoying the stars by the window, while smelling of extraterrestial flowers, - are busy with all their thoughts so as not to fly upside down to the ceiling due to zero gravity. And because of lack of varied gastronomy in this station, astronauts are unlikely to take the bliss of eating tubes - it is similar to eating toothpaste tubes )) Anyway, human space research is similar to throwing space balls into space ((



The muсh more cheaper variant and which could be theoretically closer to implementation – in water platforms creation on Earth – also expensive but also more realised with more guaranteed success: this will make it possible to very carefully plan engineering systems, and to create a better urbanization than to create cities on an unknown landscape.

When I asked my question about LGBT State idea in Quora, one user told what over 100 million people could be live there, or this is a full quantity of all gay-people on Earth (he deleted his profile as I see now, and unfortunately, our comments between us are also was deleted by Quora system). So, it can be assumed, what in our hypothetical country could live for example 30 million people... and the project could be successfull.

But I anyway would like to see our State\water platforms with extraterrestial options. If our (heterosexual) countries has contacts with, figuratively speaking, hetero-oriented aliens; gay-people could open, in some wonderful way, alternative connection with, figuratively speaking, gay-oriented aliens. If to believe in what Earth’s current countries has contacts with humanoids, humanoids, as we see, didn’t provide to people a way to completely destroy viruses from the atmosphere yet – maybe, the reason what it is not possible to filter for example COVID, and I wrote wrong about viruses filtration in space stations; maybe the reason in what this antivirus technology is a combat weapon method of elimination which could be very dangerous in people hands.

I still can’t understand, why Pozboro think what it is not good idea to build connections with aliens?

PopTart, if you are also think as Pozboro, it is not good to talk with humanoids, why? )

If to compare connections between people, for example I think what many people still don’t understand thin English humour. I suppose what human engineers could undestand extraterrestial techs, all the more so, they are understand it in a theory, but just only don’t has a practiсe – which could be provided by aliens.



Thanks!
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Re: Idea of LGBT State and Queer nation creation

Unread postby pozboro » 3 October 2021, 23:30

Simple-user wrote:I still can’t understand, why Pozboro think what it is not good idea to build connections with aliens?


That's not what I said or meant. Let me put it this way: there are two basic possible outcomes of an encounter with an alien species - 1) We figure out how to communicate with each other and do so as relative equals OR 2) They don't care what we think and they eat us. Yes, there are tons of variations on the themes, but my point was to look at how first contact went for the non-European peoples when European (and to a lesser extent, Chinese and Arab) explorers visited.

Once in a while, the natives were not interested in the visitors and killed them or drove them off. Most of the time they welcomed the new visitors and were either killed, turned into slaves, died of newly introduced contagions, their land was stolen, their women were raped, etc etc etc. Very rarely did the natives and the new arrivals come to a mutual accommodation agreement where they lived happily ever after, side by side. No, the people who arrived on the new shore assumed the natives were barbarians to either be subjugated, converted, or exterminated.

My point is, if aliens find us here on our planet - or in a space station or colony on another planet - our own history suggests we will either be subjugated or exterminated. Sure, there is a chance we will try to communicate and either that will happen or the aliens might leave, uninterested in us.

Ultimately it's a big risk that I think it is unsafe to assume aliens come in peace. They might. They might not.
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Re: Idea of LGBT State and Queer nation creation

Unread postby PopTart » 4 October 2021, 17:40

Yeah, I think we might struggle just to recognise alien life, it could be that alien to us.

There is also no guarantee that alien life would think like we do, reason as we do or value the things we do.

I am in no hurry to learn of alien life in the galaxy, I have no doubt life exists in some form in our galaxy (though I doubt intelligent life or we would have seen it by now)

It is sometimes said, that any alien intelligence, capable of reaching beyond its home planet, must have evolved beyond conflict. But I don't follow that reasoning. To rise to the top of the evolutionary ladder on any world, would require competition and a degree of self selection that doesn't lend itself to co-existance with other competing intelligences.

Add into that the fact that, the laws of physics means there is a limited amount of space, any species has absolute access to.

Sure there are billions of galaxies in the universe but we will never travel beyond our supercluster and even that might be largely beyond our reach. That leaves our local group. Two large galaxies and a couple of globulars, that we can expect to have access to. Same for anything else in the local group.

When you reach an interstellar level of expansion and development, you start to see the universe differently.

Sure, 200 billion stars is an unimaginable amount of breathing room. But each of those stars has a finite amount of energy or life. We could colonise the galaxy with the tech we have today, and it could be done in about 1 millions years.

Each star could host a Dyson swarm with centillions of people. That's alot of energy consumption. Entropy is a thing and eventually those stars will expend their fuel and star replacement will slow and then cease. It will take billions of years, plenty of time get more history in than we can imagine, before you have to think about slimming down and retreating to black holes as the heat death of the universe begins.

However....
The more alien civilisations that exist... the less real estate, so to speak, for our species.

It's quite possible that such realities, might be considerations for any space faring civilisation. No matter how far in the future this challenge might be, it's not unreasonable to think.. our long term survival is better if we are the only ones around...

It might actually make sense to eliminate any competition early and while humanity might frown at that notion, there is no assurance any other species or intelligence would have the same qualms.
In the long term, it makes more sense.

So no, I'm in no hurry to learn of intelligent alien life. Or have it learn of us.

Ofcourse, I also believe the first aliens we meet will be our descendants.

Species diverge under different conditions, living in alien environments would encourage divergences along lines we might not anticipate.

Indeed, we might engineer future colonists to survive in otherwise toxic environments.

Colonise a world with a methane thick atmosphere, engineer your colonists to breath methane, put them down on the surface and come back 10,000 years later and I'm pretty sure what you will find, will not be at all like us. They will have diverged linguistically, culturally and likely biologically enough, that they might not seem very human at all.
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Re: Idea of LGBT State and Queer nation creation

Unread postby pozboro » 4 October 2021, 19:14

Happened to see a Kids in the Hall sketch last night about two aliens complaining about their job on our planet. Not sure which they hated more, doing the anal probes or the guys who enjoyed them.

What if we meet aliens and all they want from us is to stick nasty implements ... you get the idea.
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Re: Idea of LGBT State and Queer nation creation

Unread postby PopTart » 5 October 2021, 04:37

How nasty?

Asking for a friend :shifty:
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Re: Idea of LGBT State and Queer nation creation

Unread postby pozboro » 5 October 2021, 08:09

pretty lame - Cartman got it better

Oh, but I don't think they used lube - or else the "subjects" (we human males) came pre-greased

or who knows, maybe they were snatched from a - ahem - Golden Girls viewing marathon

https://youtu.be/6tZar4wRP40

(sorry, couldn't quite figure out how to embed the video)
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Re: Idea of LGBT State and Queer nation creation

Unread postby Simple-user » 5 October 2021, 21:59

pozboro wrote:
Simple-user wrote:I still can’t understand, why Pozboro think what it is not good idea to build connections with aliens?


OR 2) They don't care what we think and they eat us.

own history suggests we will either be subjugated or exterminated. Sure, there is a chance we will try to communicate and either that will happen or the aliens might leave, uninterested in us.

Ultimately it's a big risk.


Maybe these stereotypes because of people don't trust each other? Why aliens must eat us if they can synthesize meat from plants? Why do they need stinking meat? )

I suppose what it would be most likely that humanoids will prefer to communicate with us less for that we could not ask them a bunch of stupid questions, because aliens are not a call center and will not adapt to us. But here, theoretically, our engineers could silently use, figuratively speaking, a library of alien knowledge - but another problem in access denied - here technologies (not aliens) could be very dangerous in the wrong human hands, if technologies could be reformatted to a wrong way by people...

So finally, not aliens but their robots could endlessly communicate with us.

Dangerous for us can be extraterrestial (hetero) people like us - who are less developed than us, if we would fly to their land without weapons, in order to offer a local gay community, our more developed gay community. Or a planet with dinosaurs can be very dangerous for us.
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Re: Idea of LGBT State and Queer nation creation

Unread postby Simple-user » 5 October 2021, 22:52

PopTart wrote:
Yeah, I think we might struggle just to recognise alien life, it could be that alien to us.


Why is a humanoid life form incomprehensible to us? - two arms, two legs and one head.

To rise to the top of the evolutionary ladder on any world, would require competition and a degree of self selection that doesn't lend itself to co-existance with other competing intelligences.

Sure there are billions of galaxies in the universe but we will never travel beyond our supercluster and even that might be largely beyond our reach.

Colonise a world with a methane thick atmosphere, engineer your colonists to breath methane, put them down on the surface and come back 10,000 years later and I'm pretty sure what you will find, will not be at all like us.


It seems to me that the dominance of other species, on the contrary, slows down our evolution. When people began, for example, to domesticate animals / gradually take them out of the wild / create reserves, then, accordingly, new zoo markets appeared - the economy began to develop better.

There is such a theory called the Technological Singularity. This is a hypothetical ability to move a person's consciousness\mind into the information field\space, and there people can have pleasure, including sexual pleasure, and multiply\give birth to children. Singularity involves getting rid of bodies - it sounds like death and sounds sad, but there is also the possibility of taking back physical form.
Due to the singularity, it will be possible to overcome the megaclusters of the universe. Evolution with a singularity is exceptionally humane - there will be no rigid dominance between species.

The Technological Singularity much faster and more likely to come true than descendants will learn to breathe methane for 10,000 years on an empty, boring planet; because the mind evolves much faster than biological change.

I just do not understand two moments in the singularity: whether consciousness is a soul or a soul still implies a higher level of life than the life of consciousness in the information field?; and how it would be possible to move the consciousness of animals into this information field, because without pussies\fluffies it will be sad to live there? )

It will take billions of years, plenty of time get more history in than we can imagine, before you have to think about slimming down and retreating to black holes as the heat death of the universe begins.


I have never thought that an infinite universe with infinite resources could die out)

The more alien civilisations that exist... the less real estate, so to speak, for our species.


The boundaries of "real estate" again - in an infinitely universe? )
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Re: Idea of LGBT State and Queer nation creation

Unread postby pozboro » 6 October 2021, 00:35

@PopTart: I give up.
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Re: Idea of LGBT State and Queer nation creation

Unread postby PopTart » 6 October 2021, 04:52

Simple-user wrote:The boundaries of "real estate" again - in an infinitely universe? )

The rate at which the universe is expanding, means that, even if we could achieve light speed travel, we could never reach much beyond our own supercluster, everything is just moving apart too quickly. We would be in transit forever, towards a destination that was accelerating away from us, faster than we could travel.

That is assuming we can reach light speed. Current models suggest that doing so would require more energy than can be found in the observable universe. We have neither any means of harnessing, generating or directing that kind of energy and there is no known method of doing so, even in the theoretical realm.

As to the universe being infinite, that is by no means certain anyway.

So yes, as entropy dictates, there is no such thing as "free" or "unlimited"

Finite resources/space equals competition.
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Re: Idea of LGBT State and Queer nation creation

Unread postby pozboro » 9 October 2021, 18:18

Recently saw - yawn - that Emily Blunt movie about aliens that attack whenever humans make a noise. Was it Quiet Place II? Don't remember seeing them actually eating humans or anything, so it didn't really make sense all that killing for no reason.

So maybe they were just here for the glorious butt sex and the guy from the Orifice just didn't want that in his movie?

I also watched a British mockumentary about this planet going almost entirely vegan by the end of the century. Cows are people too and all that ...

Anyway, got me thinking we should get ahead of the curve and start up a new movement - People for the Ethical Farming of Humans - so we can have all the necessary laws and infrastructure in place for when the aliens arrive, just in case, in addition to all that glorious intergalactic butt sex they really do decide they want to eat some of us. We can make it illegal to eat the gays and ensure that straights are bred HUMANely, that they are allowed to be raised free range, and that they are harvested in a kindly fashion so that their meat remains 'happy'. Surely the aliens will appreciate us for that and will just treat us to all that fantastic butt sex if we just keep them well-fed, right?
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Re: Idea of LGBT State and Queer nation creation

Unread postby PopTart » 9 October 2021, 18:37

pozboro wrote:We can make it illegal to eat the gays and ensure that straights are bred HUMANely, that they are allowed to be raised free range, and that they are harvested in a kindly fashion so that their meat remains 'happy'. Surely the aliens will appreciate us for that and will just treat us to all that fantastic butt sex if we just keep them well-fed, right?

But the we miss out on all the suggestively named gay themed meals.

La Twink Anàl creme, with a side of sautéed pomme de bears, slathered with patè suscite Otter.

And for dessert, Le Transfastique!
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Re: Idea of LGBT State and Queer nation creation

Unread postby PopTart » 9 October 2021, 18:39

Actually, given the context of the other thread, this could now sound like I'm totally a cannibal :shifty:

I mean, I'll totally have the above meal, but I'll be selective about the bits I actually swallow and everyone will leave alive. :lol:
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Re: Idea of LGBT State and Queer nation creation

Unread postby Simple-user » 13 October 2021, 14:25

Posboro, why do you still suppose what aliens must eat people? ) Fantastic films are not real life and I suppose what aiens are only peaceful and have meat-free gastronomy...

PopTart, why do you still suppose what the Universe has limited resources if there can be technologies for synthesizing things from atoms? We don't need to travel out of supercluster, it would be enough only to travel in our Milky Way.

Anyway, if without aliens, I think that it would be not bad if such a only human-made LGBT State appeared. Earth has many English speaking countries which are alike, and Gay State could be also similar to, with main gay and vegan oriented worldview.

There could be another plus one wonderful state )
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Re: Idea of LGBT State and Queer nation creation

Unread postby PopTart » 13 October 2021, 17:12

Simple-user wrote:PopTart, why do you still suppose what the Universe has limited resources if there can be technologies for synthesizing things from atoms? We don't need to travel out of supercluster, it would be enough only to travel in our Milky Way.
While the universe might be infinite, though that is very unlikely, the amount of it to which we have access, most definately is, finite. It will not be around forever. Matter or energy, is limited and is always diminishing. It's called entropy. Eventually, all the planets will be used up, all the stars will grow cold and die and all that will be left, is massive black holes, separated by unimaginable distances. Those black holes, could provide enough energy, to support a digital civilisation, for a long time. But even that, will come to an end. The heat death of the universe will be the death of everything in it. But everything usable, would have been consumed long before then and whatever civilisations that are left, won't be wasting power, on making things like water and iron or oxygen. That would cut into processing power. That could be directed at running a digital civilisation for a few more thousand years, or their digital equivalent.

Simple-user wrote:Power is the ultimate commodity and not on the sense that post modernist talk about. But the real thing.

Wait... your gay space nation is gonna be vegans? Fuck that shit.

I'll remain earth bound. There's beef here... for now atleast. Some people pushing to have that taken off the menu.
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Re: Idea of LGBT State and Queer nation creation

Unread postby pozboro » 13 October 2021, 21:50

Simple-user wrote:Posboro, why do you still suppose what aliens must eat people? ) Fantastic films are not real life and I suppose what aiens are only peaceful and have meat-free gastronomy...

PopTart, why do you still suppose what the Universe has limited resources if there can be technologies for synthesizing things from atoms? We don't need to travel out of supercluster, it would be enough only to travel in our Milky Way.

Anyway, if without aliens, I think that it would be not bad if such a only human-made LGBT State appeared. Earth has many English speaking countries which are alike, and Gay State could be also similar to, with main gay and vegan oriented worldview.

There could be another plus one wonderful state )


I don't suppose that aliens will eat humans, only that in the realm of possibilities, it's one of the many options. Who knows, an alien 'race' could not have corporal bodies or could synthesize nutrients from their atmosphere (which they would need to bring with them much like we might need to bring oxygen and food when we travel intergalactically). I do believe it's incredibly naïve to assume that sentient being on other planets must be humanoid or human analogous or even bi-pedal, heck, they might not even be organic.

edit: I forgot to mention the possibility of a completely AI civilization - we might encounter completely sentient machines.

The Gay State idea is a a different topic all together in my mind. I do have some limited knowledge of actual Lesbian Separatists from the 60s and 70s - well, I knew them after they tried living apart. But at the same time, as a true believer in diversity I have to ask, how is a Gay State any different from a White State?
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Re: Idea of LGBT State and Queer nation creation

Unread postby Simple-user » 14 October 2021, 14:06

PopTart wrote:Wait... your gay space nation is gonna be vegans? Fuck that shit.


Very interesting to hear from the UK man, what you prefer to live all your life only for just one beef, and nothing else to taste. I think what British people have gone far in the development of veganism and vegetarianism, and even created vegetarian pet foods.

About meat, I can't remember now, but it seems what meat can be harmful not only to health, but also to the nervous system, and before to start cooking meat, ideally, as far as I heard, it seems that it need to be infused in melt water for 24 hours and no less - to reduce harmfulness, and by the way - this is the opinion of conservative straight people.

About age of the Universe, why are you always worried about the age of it withering? The universe will live for many more billions of years while we, people, live very much less ) So that in our grasping no entropy threatens us, moreover, no one knows - whether the universe has boundaries - perhaps the universe is really unlimited - with unlimited entropy. About black holes - as Wiki writes, holes are "labs" for stars production, and who also knows... maybe black holes has unlimited power...
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Re: Idea of LGBT State and Queer nation creation

Unread postby Simple-user » 14 October 2021, 14:33

pozboro wrote:how is a Gay State any different from a White State?


What is the difference between countries such as: Ireland, UK, Spain, Canada, USA? These are tolerance English speaking countries which are similar to each other. But, for reasons I don't understand, Catalonia still wants to secede from Spain. Ireland is also in no hurry to connect with UK. Canada and USA are twin countries, but at the same time these are different countries.

But the main feature that makes these countries and all other countries of the world similar to each other is conservative meat gastronomy - just with different culinary decorations.

Regarding Gay State, I would not like to see plus one hetero-similar with meat gastronomy State, but this State could be also as English speaking tolerance country, but with exclusively vegan gastronomy, which would be present at every step - in any store and cafe - which does not need to be specifically looked for with a magnifying glass. It would be a fashionable Queer State ) If we assume that at least 30 million (and a maximum of 100 million) can live in such a country, then the demand for the vegan industry would increase dramatically, and there would be a lot more products that would be tastier than sausage and meat; and due it, the consciousness of people (and even the consciousness of animals) will change in the right direction, and they will be perceive any meat and sausage to taste like paper - after they try the know-how of gastronomy. So, it would be zero-discrimination and plus one zero-corruption State not only for people, but also for animals )

I see absolutely nothing wrong if such a country would appear.
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