What are you thinking at the moment?

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Re: What are you thinking at the moment?

Unread postby Derek » 9 January 2021, 00:33

I don't think there's anything wrong with being a republican as long as you have the self-awareness and shame to know you should never tell anyone or say anything about it.
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Re: What are you thinking at the moment?

Unread postby rogonandi » 9 January 2021, 06:32

Derek wrote:I don't think there's anything wrong with being a republican as long as you have the self-awareness and shame to know you should never tell anyone or say anything about it.

I don’t understand how anyone who isn’t rich or at least well off would ever be one.
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Re: What are you thinking at the moment?

Unread postby Severelius » 9 January 2021, 13:30

rogonandi wrote:
Derek wrote:I don't think there's anything wrong with being a republican as long as you have the self-awareness and shame to know you should never tell anyone or say anything about it.

I don’t understand how anyone who isn’t rich or at least well off would ever be one.

Republicans have been very clever at convincing the poorest of society that if they only vote Republican, they'll be millionaires eventually, running their own giant businesses and being 'job creators' to millions of people.

You can't vote for higher taxes for people making over $100,000 a year if YOU might someday make that, after all.
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Re: What are you thinking at the moment?

Unread postby OutsideIn » 9 January 2021, 20:10

I am not sure there is much point is saying this, and I don't want to pick a fight. But I see a lot of incorrect and dismissive statements here, and that is part of the reason we have such a growing gap between the different sides. These kinds of divides have always existed, but they are exacerbated by the 24-hour news cycle (although it's far more opinion than news these days) and social media. It is no wonder that VagrantMenagerie feels so isolated and like he can't speak without it turning into an argument.

Based on what I saw most recently, the majority of big donators, both individual and corporate, support Republicans, but the average income of Democratic voters is higher. I am not sure you can say either side is the party of the rich. Lower income Republicans don't believe they are going to get rich themselves. Many of them work for these same companies that donate to the Republicans, and they fear that if those companies shrink or dissolve, whether due to higher corporate taxes, immigration, environmental laws, or globalizing the economy, they will lose their livelihoods. And if I am being honest, that fear is not without merit. It is has already happened in many areas of the country, and that is why so many of these people are angry. The anger is the emotion that you see on the surface. If you look deeper, you will see that a lot of it is really fueled by fear. They feel like their very existence is being attacked from all sides.

Let me be clear that I am not saying that I agree with conservative viewpoints. I am fairly moderate in my personal leanings. I grew up around conservatives. I grew up believing what they said because that is all I knew. It has taken lifetime to reevaluate my world view. I may disagree with them now, but I think I understand them better than people who didn't grow up here.
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Re: What are you thinking at the moment?

Unread postby Brenden » 9 January 2021, 20:40

"Socialism never took root in America because the poor see themselves not as an exploited proletariat but as temporarily embarrassed millionaires." — John Steinbeck

That quoted, the problem with most rank and file Republicans is their tribalism. Many share views on specific issues, especially regarding wealth and welfare, with rank and file Democrats, yet ever voting Democrat is anathema to them.
Disclaimer: All views expressed in my posts are my own and do not reflect the views of this forum except when otherwise stated or this signature is not present.

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Re: What are you thinking at the moment?

Unread postby OutsideIn » 9 January 2021, 22:49

The quote sounds catchy, but I can't find any aspect of it that rings true for me based on growing up in this part of the world. I assume this is directed at conservative poor people since liberal poor citizens would presumably support some form of socialism. Conservative objection to socialism is two-fold. One part is that is seen as laziness to be dependent on the government instead of one's own hard work. The other part is the being dependent on the government implicitly surrenders individual rights and opens us up to oppression by our leaders. Both of these are rooted in our upbringing. We are taught from a young age that our country was founded on a rebellion against an oppressive monarchy and that we grew from a bundle of disjointed colonies into the most powerful nation on earth by our own blood, sweat, and tears. (They conveniently gloss over that whole slavery and genocide bit since it does not neatly fit into the overall narrative of American exceptionalism.)

The irony is that conservative areas have become more dependent on government assistance than more liberal places. There have been a lot of articles on this that can describe it better than I can. It isn't seen as a form of socialism. It is seen more as a leveling of the playing field because of inequities caused by the same government. Farmers have to take subsidies because the government makes it too easy for other countries to import goods and our own farmers can't compete. People have to stay on welfare because the government is allowing all of our jobs to be sent overseas. They practically have no choice. These are the same people that will accuse urban welfare recipients (in other words African Americans) of being lazy no-gooders who milk the government for everything they can. Obviously there is a massive amount of racisism behind that sentiment, but I also see two other aspects of the human condition. One is that people have a great deal of trouble seeing any other perspective but their own, and the other is that people will justify any form of behavior, even ones they supposedly abhor, if it benefits them to do so. Mental gymnastics should be an Olympic sport. Americans would always take the gold.

I do agree with tribalism being a huge issue, but it is definitely not something that is exclusive to conservatives. I see it everywhere from white supremacists to football fans (American or otherwise, doesn't matter). In fact, I think it is baked into our DNA for survival which is partly what makes it so difficult to combat.

Take any poll you see with a huge grain of salt. As pollsters having recently discovered (I could have told them this years ago), conversatives, especially the more fundamentalist ones, distrust the institutions that usually gather these statistics, and they know that their views are often controversial. They either lie or avoid the polls altogether. Our political polls are basically garbage now, and people get caught off guard when reality ends up being completely disconnected from what the polls showed.

I feel the need to repeat that I don't agree with these conservative views. But I also don't agree with the characterizations of a lot conservative ideas because I grew up around them. Conservative platforms latch on to the these statements to say "see? the liberals are telling lies about us!" And then, of course, they turn right around and do the same thing to you. You have to love the hypocrisy of it all.
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Re: What are you thinking at the moment?

Unread postby kotek91 » 10 January 2021, 14:33

Brenden wrote:
Marmaduke wrote:
Brenden wrote:There are so many English people with Received Pronunciation in Edinburgh. :runaway:

Feel bad for the international tourists that come all the way to Scotland and end up having to hear so many shopkeepers in the touristy parts of Edinburgh speaking to them with a posh Southern accent.

What’s wrong with a Southern accent? :argh:

Well, for the tourists, if they wanted that particular experience I imagine they’d have travelled to London! :P

Natural Southern accents are also perfectly fine, but RP comes across as so fake. Maybe it’s not even RP in general but like a particular variety common amongst upper middle class students attending the University of Edinburgh and working in the local shops and cafes. :shrug:



Brenden what is so wrong with RP accent. Less than 3 percent of people speak like that but this accent gives you a prestige. I speak with RP accent . I had a funny story for;example some English man was angry for me and he said Why do you speak like that ,you're not even a queen. I told him because I love it:P) lol. :D
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Re: What are you thinking at the moment?

Unread postby Marmaduke » 10 January 2021, 14:42

kotek91 wrote:
Brenden wrote:
Marmaduke wrote:
Brenden wrote:There are so many English people with Received Pronunciation in Edinburgh. :runaway:

Feel bad for the international tourists that come all the way to Scotland and end up having to hear so many shopkeepers in the touristy parts of Edinburgh speaking to them with a posh Southern accent.

What’s wrong with a Southern accent? :argh:

Well, for the tourists, if they wanted that particular experience I imagine they’d have travelled to London! :P

Natural Southern accents are also perfectly fine, but RP comes across as so fake. Maybe it’s not even RP in general but like a particular variety common amongst upper middle class students attending the University of Edinburgh and working in the local shops and cafes. :shrug:



Brenden what is so wrong with RP accent. Less than 3 percent of people speak like that but this accent gives you a prestige. I speak with RP accent . I had a funny story for;example some English man was angry for me and he said Why do you speak like that ,you're not even a queen. I told him because I love it:P) lol. :D

I can imagine that Received Pronunciation coming from a person for whom English is a second language can’t help but come across as incredibly patronising when speaking to English people.
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Re: What are you thinking at the moment?

Unread postby kotek91 » 10 January 2021, 15:19

Imagine that one amercian guy in his 21 years speaks to me i n my language in that way as I speak . I was shocked really. Ho told me that he practised a lot. It is possible to speak English very clear without yourown accent.
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Re: What are you thinking at the moment?

Unread postby OprahWindFury » 10 January 2021, 15:47

That the world is a burning trash fire which I hope eventually gets a little dimmer.
A leash can be pulled from either end.

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Re: What are you thinking at the moment?

Unread postby ceez » 10 January 2021, 21:49

Enough politics for now, what's really important is my love for home made waffles and bacon :heart:
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Re: What are you thinking at the moment?

Unread postby OutsideIn » 10 January 2021, 22:11

ceez wrote:Enough politics for now, what's really important is my love for home made waffles and bacon :heart:

And yet you offered neither to us.
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PostThis post was deleted by René on 11 January 2021, 01:35.
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Re: What are you thinking at the moment?

Unread postby Derek » 11 January 2021, 05:19

It's fucked up how comfortable people online are wishing rape upon people as a matter of retributive justice ("I bet he'll be popular in prison"). It's like how normalized it is to say racist shit about Chinese people. Do they just not actually believe that racism is bad and sexual violence is never justified? How do they square it?
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PostThis post was deleted by poolerboy0077 on 11 January 2021, 05:43.
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Re: What are you thinking at the moment?

Unread postby erti » 11 January 2021, 05:46

Derek wrote:It's fucked up how comfortable people online are wishing rape upon people as a matter of retributive justice ("I bet he'll be popular in prison"). It's like how normalized it is to say racist shit about Chinese people. Do they just not actually believe that racism is bad and sexual violence is never justified? How do they square it?


As someone who is a survivor of sexual abuse and rape I get what you’re talking about. I don’t want what happened to me happen to anyone else. I do wish he served time in prison and put on the sex offender list. Mainly to prevent kids from getting victimized by the bastard... how ever I’ll admit there’s jealousy I have with him. How can he do that stuff to me and get away from it. I don’t hate him... yet I do... It’s too late to prosecute because it’s been longer than 20 years. At least that’s to my knowledge.
“Don't take my devils away, because my angels may flee too.”

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Re: What are you thinking at the moment?

Unread postby rogonandi » 11 January 2021, 09:16

Derek wrote:It's fucked up how comfortable people online are wishing rape upon people as a matter of retributive justice ("I bet he'll be popular in prison"). It's like how normalized it is to say racist shit about Chinese people. Do they just not actually believe that racism is bad and sexual violence is never justified? How do they square it?

I’m not an expert on the subject but in addition to rape being an act of violence and subjugation, isn’t it also a way to destroy the ego of the victim? Ego is a gigantic part of what drives many people, so perhaps a raping would be a good way to knock a wrongdoer down a few pegs?
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Re: What are you thinking at the moment?

Unread postby OutsideIn » 11 January 2021, 13:11

Derek wrote:It's fucked up how comfortable people online are wishing rape upon people as a matter of retributive justice ("I bet he'll be popular in prison"). It's like how normalized it is to say racist shit about Chinese people. Do they just not actually believe that racism is bad and sexual violence is never justified? How do they square it?

They don’t square it because they don’t think about it. It is usually hyperbole. Most of them of have probably never been a victim of real violence or even seen it in real life other than on the news. It works in reverse too. Some gamers love to shout out that they are being sexually assaulted in some fashion when they are losing. They don’t stop think about what they are really saying.

And isn’t it worse to tell someone to go to hell, meaning die and spend eternity in torment? We say that so casually these days.

The more I have realized that I am an over-thinker, the more I have realized how many people are under-thinkers. It is not a matter of intelligence. I am sure most are smarter than me. It is about pausing from time to time to reflect on what we are really thinking, doing, and saying.
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Re: What are you thinking at the moment?

Unread postby PopTart » 11 January 2021, 21:51

Derek wrote:It's fucked up how comfortable people online are wishing rape upon people as a matter of retributive justice ("I bet he'll be popular in prison"). It's like how normalized it is to say racist shit about Chinese people. Do they just not actually believe that racism is bad and sexual violence is never justified? How do they square it?

Oh, the irony.
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Re: What are you thinking at the moment?

Unread postby rogonandi » 11 January 2021, 22:22

Lately I’ve been thinking about handsome men in uniforms. :D
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