Lonely, what am I doing wrong?

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Re: Lonely, what am I doing wrong?

Unread postby OperaBuff » 19 October 2018, 05:21

MX, I believe each thing I've said on this message board. Derek, what does Starbucks do to Christians in December? I wouldn't know, since I don't drink coffee.
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Re: Lonely, what am I doing wrong?

Unread postby OperaBuff » 19 October 2018, 05:40

MX, I would tell my friend that I want him to live a holy Catholic life and that when he's happy, confident, and feeling good about himself, he'll feel same-sex attractions very rarely or not all. If he's repressing his homosexuality by being happy, feeling good about himself, and feeling connected to other people, what's so bad about the repression?
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Re: Lonely, what am I doing wrong?

Unread postby PopTart » 19 October 2018, 15:35

Just to re-iterate what has been said for you Jaketh, there are a great many issues within the gay community, some relating to isolation and loneliness.

If anything that has been said here, has given you reason to doubt if you can ever be happy AND gay, I can say, unequivocally, that you can. Let no-one tell you that your happiness hinges upon the sex that you do or do not have. Or the people you choose to love or who love you in return.

Loneliness exists in every social group of humanity and not one is exempt from it. Will you find a guy you will fall indeniably in love with and who will love you the same way back? There are no gaurentees, but the same is true for any sexual orientation.

All we can do, as individuals, gay or straight, furry or vanilla, glamour model or thugly, is keep ourselves open to the possibility, to work our hardest at being the people we most want to be and treating others as we ourselves want to be treated and be open and receptive, should someone find us amidst the ocean of people out there. Make yourself available, find peace with the possibility that it might never happen and work at being happy in and of yourself.
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Re: Lonely, what am I doing wrong?

Unread postby lightnight » 19 October 2018, 20:38

mxguy01 wrote:
lightnight wrote:Thank you for highlighting that bit in that sea of text, mxguy101.

LoL. Am I 101, an famous he here in Cali. Or am I 01? Or am I really 27b, my race number. I appear to have an idenity crisis.



Oh... Sorry :P I often get the over the number part wrong in most usernames with numbers.... Even if it's as simple as 01, apparently... I'll remember yours now!
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Re: Lonely, what am I doing wrong?

Unread postby GearFetTwinkRomance » 20 October 2018, 21:38

OperaBuff wrote:No, that's not what I'm implying. I agree with Dr. Nicolosi when he says that people act out homosexually, they do because they're trying to repair an emotional wound that they got in very early childhood. He says that when his clients feel, happy, confident, loved, and connected to other people, they don't feel homosexual feelings, even when they try to feel them. Ultimately, he think that what triggers homosexual feelings is shame. His clients don't feel shame because they're gay. They're gay because they've been shamed.


I have not read everything yet. I might do so, but that must be about the most wrong crock of horse shyte I read in ages! Dude! :flame:

Do they ever think about the principle of simply love?

I have heard of this Dr.Nicolosi before, wasn't he one of the most homophobic geeks of our time? One of those ex-gay and gay switch therapy errants, I think. NARTH or so. He died somewhen last year, eh. I do feel sorry for the blindness of these people, but usually it goes back to religious indoctrination and knowledge denial.

OperaBuff wrote:If he's repressing his homosexuality by being happy, feeling good about himself, and feeling connected to other people, what's so bad about the repression?


I know you were addressing mxguy, but just think about it for once - repressing oneself on the most significant planes of one's own nature, which is the ability for love and sexual fulfilling, can't be a way to find happiness - it will lead toward the opposite and pretty well get you crazy over time, in the way, celibacy would, and it does to many of those who choose to live deprived of love and sexuality. To choose this for yourself, that is your own responsibility. It's your psychological health you will ruin. But don't advise other people toward that manipulative a self-destructive method.

On the other hand, living out sexuality and love makes quite a few people very happy. And who said, one can't raise their kids as a gay couple, living married or just for commitment in an alternative way?
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Re: Lonely, what am I doing wrong?

Unread postby Jaket403 » 22 October 2018, 15:06

I'm definitely still watching this thread and some of you have been helpful and at the very least help me feel like I'm. Not. Operabuff, I kind of feel like you read like the first couple of sentences and then stopped. While I am a religious person and my religion did have a lot to do with why it took so long for me to come out I do recognize that other believers do not think like me. Thank you for your reply
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Re: Lonely, what am I doing wrong?

Unread postby Jaket403 » 22 October 2018, 15:10

From someone who has been repressing his entire life, any expression of happiness is a show for YOU and society. Before I came out I died inside a little everytime o pretended to have a new girl friend or new relationship. It truly does more harm than good. Another thing I have learned through all of this is that straight people simply dont understand. Not to be exclusionary, but honestly until you've spent your entire life pretending to be someone else you honestly cant understand what its like to live that double life and to live inside your head




OperaBuff wrote:MX, I would tell my friend that I want him to live a holy Catholic life and that when he's happy, confident, and feeling good about himself, he'll feel same-sex attractions very rarely or not all. If he's repressing his homosexuality by being happy, feeling good about himself, and feeling connected to other people, what's so bad about the repression?
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Re: Lonely, what am I doing wrong?

Unread postby Jzone » 23 October 2018, 02:25

I'm so glad you chimed in here, Jake (Jake, Jaket, 403). Buffy was a weird one, and he could really mess with you. This forum has much better support to offer than his twisted conversion ideology.
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Re: Lonely, what am I doing wrong?

Unread postby OB2 » 24 October 2018, 21:26

Jaket, sometimes platonic friendships become romantic when the friends become, say, best friends. Other times when people live together before they marry, passion blinds them to faults that harm their relationship after the honeymoon. Then divorce may be more likely than it would have been had they lived apart to save sex for marriage. If I look mostly for something as superficial as mere sexual attraction, then my significant other may only seem right for me. So for me, a mere sexual attraction would be unimportant compared to whether I had found the one God picked for me. My God-given soulmate would be the woman I would long to stay with for the rest of my life, even if she got ugly, incontinent, bedridden, and caught severe Alzheimer's disease. Maybe there's nothing you're doing wrong. Ultimately, you want romance and deep lifelong love. But to find it, you may need to focus first on close platonic friendship and on the kind of love you feel for your family. Maybe the right question is, "What does God want to give me?" instead of "What am I doing wrong?".

You're reflecting eloquently on what you want and on what you need. That's why I believe you'll find who or what God wants to bless you with to make you happy.
Last edited by OB2 on 24 October 2018, 23:40, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Lonely, what am I doing wrong?

Unread postby Jaket403 » 24 October 2018, 21:55

Ob2, solid advice. Now that I'm honest about my sexuality it's possible that I will start making more gay friends where a friendship could turn into something more. I've been in the closet so long and was so afraid I wouldnt even stand near another gay person for fear of someone assuming that i was also gay. I will keep your advice in mind
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Re: Lonely, what am I doing wrong?

Unread postby OB2 » 25 October 2018, 01:59

Jaket403 wrote:Ob2, solid advice. Now that I'm honest about my sexuality it's possible that I will start making more gay friends where a friendship could turn into something more. I've been in the closet so long and was so afraid I wouldnt even stand near another gay person for fear of someone assuming that i was also gay. I will keep your advice in mind

Jaket, maybe you were still honest with everyone else while you stayed the closest because everyone needs to keep some secrets sometimes. You aren't lying to anyone when you refuse to blab after someone confides in you. If someone asks you something, you should answer honestly. But honesty doesn't require you to reveal more than the other person should know.

There's even a way to fool other people honestly when it would be unethical to tell them what they want to know. To see what I mean, suppose that during the Holocaust, a Nazi soldier demands to know whether you're harboring Jews in your home. If you say "no," then you're lying to him. But you're being honest with him when you tell him a truth knowing that he'll draw a false conclusion from it. If you dated women because you hoped that someday she would attract you, that might give some people an incorrect impression of you. Still, liars intend to deceieve you wouldn't have meant to do that.

Sometimes I worry about what other people will believe about me, especially when I might seem "guilty by association." So I understand the fear that made you hesitate to stand next to another gay man before you left the closet. I try not to worry about what other people think of me because, in the end, what matters most is what God, I and the people I love think of me. Since I'm straight and very open about my socially conservative beliefs, I may not make any far-left friends here at GF. I may not make any friends here and I can deal with that.

Other posters may like, love, dislike, or even hate me. I can cope with that serenely, though, because I don't expect and don't need everyone to like me. Pschologists assure me that hatred is a feeling. To me, what's more important than the negative emotions others may feel about me is what they do when they feel them. Those feelings aren't sins. But they can tempt some people to sin.
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Re: Lonely, what am I doing wrong?

Unread postby PopTart » 26 October 2018, 15:16

OB2 wrote:
Jaket403 wrote:Ob2, solid advice. Now that I'm honest about my sexuality it's possible that I will start making more gay friends where a friendship could turn into something more. I've been in the closet so long and was so afraid I wouldnt even stand near another gay person for fear of someone assuming that i was also gay. I will keep your advice in mind

Jaket, maybe you were still honest with everyone else while you stayed the closest because everyone needs to keep some secrets sometimes. You aren't lying to anyone when you refuse to blab after someone confides in you. If someone asks you something, you should answer honestly. But honesty doesn't require you to reveal more than the other person should know.

There's even a way to fool other people honestly when it would be unethical to tell them what they want to know. To see what I mean, suppose that during the Holocaust, a Nazi soldier demands to know whether you're harboring Jews in your home. If you say "no," then you're lying to him. But you're being honest with him when you tell him a truth knowing that he'll draw a false conclusion from it. If you dated women because you hoped that someday she would attract you, that might give some people an incorrect impression of you. Still, liars intend to deceieve you wouldn't have meant to do that.

Sometimes I worry about what other people will believe about me, especially when I might seem "guilty by association." So I understand the fear that made you hesitate to stand next to another gay man before you left the closet. I try not to worry about what other people think of me because, in the end, what matters most is what God, I and the people I love think of me. Since I'm straight and very open about my socially conservative beliefs, I may not make any far-left friends here at GF. I may not make any friends here and I can deal with that.

Other posters may like, love, dislike, or even hate me. I can cope with that serenely, though, because I don't expect and don't need everyone to like me. Pschologists assure me that hatred is a feeling. To me, what's more important than the negative emotions others may feel about me is what they do when they feel them. Those feelings aren't sins. But they can tempt some people to sin.

So... are you OperaBluff? Version 2.0?
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Re: Lonely, what am I doing wrong?

Unread postby OB2 » 26 October 2018, 15:56

PopTart, I inactivated my OperaBuff account because I meant to stay away. But I returned renamed because I worried about Jake and another poster, regretted that I had offended some posters, and hoped to talk serenely with you and others here when I started anew with a new "identity." Sadly, although I mean well, sometimes I still write too frankly about subjects better left unmentioned.
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Re: Lonely, what am I doing wrong?

Unread postby PopTart » 26 October 2018, 18:38

OB2 wrote:PopTart, I inactivated my OperaBuff account because I meant to stay away. But I returned renamed because I worried about Jake and another poster, regretted that I had offended some posters, and hoped to talk serenely with you and others here when I started anew with a new "identity." Sadly, although I mean well, sometimes I still write too frankly about subjects better left unmentioned.

I'm not about to tell you to get lost, thats not my job and I do believe that everyone deserves a second chance. That said, I will say that you would do well not to recommend conversion therapy to our members, publicly or privately. I can't say I would have much respect for that here or anywhere. If I hear of it, I'll be making quite the ruckus to have you summarily banned.

I'd also say that, it would have been less dubious for you to return with your original account. We all make mistakes, seeking to distance and hide your mistakes and start afresh, doesn't speak to confronting and overcoming those shortcomings that lead to said mistakes and becoming a better person, you might have done better to acknowledge them and earn back the respect and trust of the community here, rather than attempting to decieve people with a new identity.

The cats out of the bag. If you are genuine in your desire to be a positive and beneficial member of the forum, then I would encourage you to demonstrate your conviction by example and by being honest with the community here. But for the time being, don't be surprised if people aren't immediately won over.

Best of luck.
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Re: Lonely, what am I doing wrong?

Unread postby OB2 » 26 October 2018, 19:13

I meant no dishonesty when I renamed myself. Since it was impossible for me to log back into my other account, I needed to choose a new screen name. So maybe my new one should have been something like "OperaBuffAgain."

Although I believe firmly in reparative therapy, I don't need to bring it up here anymore. But if someone else wants to discuss it, I'll be happy to join the conversation.

Even if I never win anyone else over, I can still feel serene because I know that I'm sincere.

If the idea of reparative therapy is gravely offensive, I ask you and other people here to remember that here in the U.S., some straight social conservatives may feel gravely offended when some progressives impulsively accuse them of homophobia when they deserve the benefit of the doubt. You, PopTart, are at least willing to give me a second chance. That's more than I can say for those Americans who accuse supposed homophobes imprudently and falsely.
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Re: Lonely, what am I doing wrong?

Unread postby PopTart » 26 October 2018, 20:37

OB2 wrote:I meant no dishonesty when I renamed myself. Since it was impossible for me to log back into my other account, I needed to choose a new screen name. So maybe my new one should have been something like "OperaBuffAgain."

Although I believe firmly in reparative therapy, I don't need to bring it up here anymore. But if someone else wants to discuss it, I'll be happy to join the conversation.

Even if I never win anyone else over, I can still feel serene because I know that I'm sincere.

If the idea of reparative therapy is gravely offensive, I ask you and other people here to remember that here in the U.S., some straight social conservatives may feel gravely offended when some progressives impulsively accuse them of homophobia when they deserve the benefit of the doubt. You, PopTart, are at least willing to give me a second chance. That's more than I can say for those Americans who accuse imprudently and falsely.

You were likely unable to access your previous account, because you were banned for inappropriate and harmful behaviour.

Don't be surprised if you find this account banned also, your attitude hasn't changed from the language and wording of your post.

Why is it you are here on the gayforum OperaBuff? What exactly is it you seek in being an active participant here?

I and many others here not only find conversion therapy offensive, but dangerous and damaging to a persons mental wellbeing. By the mere re-branding of conversion therapy to "reparative therapy" speaks of an opinion that our sexuality is evidence of damage or pyschological dysfunction. For those of us that know better, for those of us who are not filled with fear and terror of our own selves and our very natural desires, that is not only offensive, it is borderline abusive and harmful.

Why are you here OperaBuff?

Accusing someone who speaks with derogatory language and harmful ideas to our well being and preys upon those amongst us who are vulnerable, no matter how congenially, a homophobe or regressive, may well be offensive, but it doesn't make it any less true. This is an understanding we have gained from lifetimes of experience being subjected to the harsh reality of homophobia and regressive thought. Being an American or not, has nothing to do with it. That is an experience and education that transcends borders of language, culture or nationality.

Why are you really here OperaBuff?

You speak of imprudence and falsehood, but the only one here who has been false or decietful, is you OperaBuff. You have lied about who you are, you have spoken about your approval and agreement of ideas that are harmful to gay men, who might be vulnerable enough to believe that their unhappiness stems from their sexual or romantic preferences and not from more complex and nuanced issues both in themselves, their lives and the world around them. As for imprudence, you may be somewhat low key in your demeanour and approach, but I find you proselytizing to be unctuous, riddled with self loathing coupled with arrogance, quite the flamboyant and dramatic display. I don't say this with the intent to be offensive, neither do I seek to drive you away. But to draw attention to the fact, that your manner and attitude doesn't go unnoticed and that while you may feel some have judged you unfairly, I'm here to tell you, most everybody has been postively respectful, all things considering.

If you are here, in the hopes of finding an audience for your ideals and beliefs, validation by converting others, as you may once have been converted, you'll find no affirmation here. We look after our own. A pity there was no-one there to do the same for you when it would have counted.

If you are here, to preach about the sinful nature of our choices, to point everytime that some expresses sadness, or hardship in the life they have chosen and seek to capitalise on their grief to further your own beliefs and suggest that "God made it so" You'll find no audience here.

If however, you are here, because in your heart of hearts, you know that what you are selling, is someone elses bullshit and it doesn't mean what it once did for you and your struggling to find a way to accept that new reality and make peace with the choices you have made. Then perhaps you might find an audience. But make no mistake, we will not allow someone to sully this place, where we come for a sense of support and community, with negative attitudes or judgemental sermonising. No matter how discreet or circumspect.
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Re: Lonely, what am I doing wrong?

Unread postby OB2 » 27 October 2018, 01:16

PopTart,

The board's server locked me out of my "OperaBuff" account because I knowingly made it do that. But as you may already know, I rejoined the forum because I worried about two posters who probably will prefer to ignore me now. If they ignore me, I'll understand and I'll still like them a lot.

At first, I joined GF because I wanted and still want to try to feel more empathy for people who feel same-sex attractions. Naturally, I'll agree that I wrote imprudently about reparative therapy, which differs from conversion therapy partly because conversion therapists focus mostly on "turning homosexuals into heterosexuals." Reparative therapists, on the other hand, try to help the client heal emotional wounds that, for reparative therapists, underlie same-sex attractions. If you watched a 15-minute part of a reparative therapy session I saw on a YouTube video, I'm sure you'll agree that there was nothing emotionally abusive about that partial session.

Sometimes when I react too emotionally to something that happens to me, I feel sure that I know how things are in my life when they're actually much different from how they seem. Too often my feelings cloud my judgment when I let them get too strong or when I think too much about me. So I try to remember that C.S. Lewis says, "Humility isn't thinking less of yourself. It's thinking of yourself less." During severe emotional pain, I'm self-centered enough to only seem to see rejections, insults, hatred, and more from people who aren't trying to wrong me. They don't even know that I think they've tried to do that. After I overreact and misinterpret something that I go through. I need to learn a healthier way to cope with that sort of thing in the future. Otherwise, in similar situations, I may suffer from other imaginary things that other people only seemed to do to me.

I'm happy to talk with you and I'm sorry you feel offended by some things I wrote. That's why I wish I knew a serene unemotional way for you and me to talk about what you and others have found insulting in some posts I wrote. In the Introduction to his Skeptical Essays, Lord Bertrand Russell makes a point that's true about me. The more passionate we are about what we believe, the less evidence we have for it. But genuine knowers, he believes, argue calmly for what they know and then wait for the arguments to convince their hearers.
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Re: Lonely, what am I doing wrong?

Unread postby Jzone » 27 October 2018, 02:40

OB2 wrote:I returned renamed because I worried about Jake and another poster, regretted that I had offended some posters, and hoped to talk serenely with you and others here when I started anew with a new "identity." Sadly, although I mean well, sometimes I still write too frankly about subjects better left unmentioned.

Buffy, you needn't worry about Jake and any other young men here. They have more support from many of us than you imagine.

As this is a forum for gay people to socialize, share their experience, and support each other; it should come as no surprise that a supposedly straight and celibate person promoting "reparative therapy" would not be well received. Your ideas about gay reparative therapy are out-dated, have been thoroughly debunked and discredited, and should be assigned to the landfill of history.
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Re: Lonely, what am I doing wrong?

Unread postby OB2 » 27 October 2018, 03:10

Jzone wrote:
OB2 wrote:I returned renamed because I worried about Jake and another poster, regretted that I had offended some posters, and hoped to talk serenely with you and others here when I started anew with a new "identity." Sadly, although I mean well, sometimes I still write too frankly about subjects better left unmentioned.

Buffy, you needn't worry about Jake and any other young men here. They have more support from many of us than you imagine.

As this is a forum for gay people to socialize, share their experience, and support each other; it should come as no surprise that a supposedly straight and celibate person promoting "reparative therapy" would not be well received. Your ideas about gay reparative therapy are out-dated, have been thoroughly debunked and discredited, and should be assigned to the landfill of history.

Thank you, Jzone. I'll stop worrying about him partly because my worrying can't help him. But I want him and the other young man to know that I'm their friend, even if the friendship isn't mutual.

I could reply to your point about reparative therapy. But since my beliefs reparative therapy have helped offend PopTart and maybe many others, I'll keep quiet about that therapy now when no one here wants to discuss it with me.
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Re: Lonely, what am I doing wrong?

Unread postby PopTart » 27 October 2018, 09:51

OB2 wrote:
Jzone wrote:
OB2 wrote:I returned renamed because I worried about Jake and another poster, regretted that I had offended some posters, and hoped to talk serenely with you and others here when I started anew with a new "identity." Sadly, although I mean well, sometimes I still write too frankly about subjects better left unmentioned.

Buffy, you needn't worry about Jake and any other young men here. They have more support from many of us than you imagine.

As this is a forum for gay people to socialize, share their experience, and support each other; it should come as no surprise that a supposedly straight and celibate person promoting "reparative therapy" would not be well received. Your ideas about gay reparative therapy are out-dated, have been thoroughly debunked and discredited, and should be assigned to the landfill of history.

Thank you, Jzone. I'll stop worrying about him partly because my worrying can't help him. But I want him and the other young man to know that I'm their friend, even if the friendship isn't mutual.

I could reply to your point about reparative therapy. But since my beliefs reparative therapy have helped offend PopTart and maybe many others, I'll keep quiet about that therapy now when no one here wants to discuss it with me.

You haven't offended me, what bothers me is the idea that you may have the intention of covertly promoting something, that I have seen to be harmful and detrimental to a persons well being.

There are a litany of threads across this forum and others like it, tales across the gay world, of the deep and unabiding pain that comes from self denial and repression of ones true self.

It is the notion itself, that homosexuality is the product of harm in our pasts that defines our sexuality, as Jzone has said, not only has the idea been debunked and discredited, we know this not to be true. That offends me. It is also true, that there are people who, perhaps, are going through difficult times and trying to understand why they might feel unhappy, who may be sucked in by "seemingly" clever talk and "seemingly" genuine care, who may listen to such things, and not know enough to know that what you promote, is dangerous and harmful.

While there are people here, who seek guidance and support, I can say unequivocally, that what you have offered so far, is not the kind of help they need.

As to Jaket and certainly Splash, I think they have made it known that what you have offered, is not what they want.

I don't know if perhaps you are lonely and are looking for a connection, I can appreciate that you too may be trying to muddle through issues of your own, but if there is to be friendship between you and any other person, here or anywhere, that is not something you can foist upon someone else, but instead must be nurtured, developed and worked upon in a mutual setting.

While you may wish to understand gay people and develop a degree of empathy for those of us who identify as gay or bisexual, that desire should never trump the prioority, that is care and consideration, for the well being of someone else.
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