#Feminism

Discuss the news, current events, politics, celebrity gossip, etc.

#Feminism

Unread postby Bro » 9 March 2015, 06:36

When I see women being treated as garbage or a second class, it breaks my heart, they deserve the same equality and dignity as us men, I hate how men uses power & ideology to control and oppress women, men and women together make a strong bond, we shouldn't hate the other sex or gender, we should love everyone no matter what. ‪Feminism‬ doesn't mean you hate men, it means you believe in gender equality, stop misusing the word feminism and our women, they are part of our humanity. Women are strong, its about time we change how the world perceives a women's strength, not as weak but as strong.

Happy Women's International Day! :)

Facts about women:

-Every 90 seconds a women dies during pregnancy or birth.
-20% women in the U.S earns at least $5 more than their spouse.
-Women speak about 20,000 more words a day. That's 13,000 more words than the average men.
-All of the 20 richest women in the world except #17 inherited their money from either their husband or father.
-The average women in UK owns 19 pairs of shoes but only wears 7.
-In Russia theres 9 million more women than men.
-40% of births in the U.S come from unmarried women.
-Women spend nearly one year of their lives deciding what to wear.
-Women cry on average between 30 - 64 times a year, while men cry between 6 - 17.
-Men lie 6 times a day, twice as often as women.
-The youngest girl to divorce was 10 years old.
-Men were the first to wear high heels around 1600s. Women began wearing them to look more masculine.
-The woman who underwent the world's first successful womb transplant became pregnant in 2013.
-Women spend over 4 years (in total)of their lives menstruating.
-Women have more taste buds than men.
-Some women can have a genetic mutation which causes them to see millions of more colors.
-An average woman in the UK will own 111 handbags in her lifetime.
-30% of pregnant women crave nonfood items, an eating disorder called pica.
-Women can get pregnant even 5 to 8 days after having sex.
-The most children born to one woman is 69.
-68% of women say they would have an affair if they knew they could get away with it.
-Women think about their appearance 9 times a day, a UK survey found.
-Women were first allowed to participate at the Olympic Games in 1900.
-Heart disease is the No. 1 killer of women.
-Women are better multitaskers than men.
-Only 2% of women describe themselves as beautiful.
-Women blink 19 times per minute, compared to 11 for men.
-Women in Niger have an average of 7 children, the world's highest rate.
-Over 80% of women wear the wrong bra size.
-Women live longer than men partly because their immune systems age more slowly.
-The average woman in the UK has 150 different hairstyles in her lifetime

Humanist:
A person having a strong interest in or concern for human welfare, values, and dignity.
A system of values and beliefs that is based on the idea that people are basically good and that problems can be solved using reason instead of religion.

Feminism:
The belief that men and women should have equal rights and opportunities
Advocating social, political, legal, and economic rights for women equal to those of men.

Humanism & Feminism are both good things, stop hating!
Last edited by Bro on 10 March 2015, 17:31, edited 1 time in total.
Bro
 
Posts: 160
+1s received: 1
Joined: 30 October 2014, 09:51

Re: #Feminism

Unread postby 832843 » 10 March 2015, 06:45

I 100% agree.
I would happily say I'm a feminist in the sense that I don't believe that women should be hierarchically over men, but that I believe in gender equality.
Nowadays the expectations of women in society are becoming a lot more equal.
Unless you come from a very wealthy family, most couples trying to own a home need both people working because it's virtually impossible other wise.
Women are expected to have the same education as men, function the same within those roles and earn money to pay off loans and mortgages, and fathers are being encouraged to actually be more involved at home, so in that sense why shouldn't they be equal in rights and opportunity.
I mean they're taxed just as much as men.

Some people automatically get defensive when they hear the word "feminism" and that's because people associate feminism as anti-men when it's not at all, or at least it shouldn't be.
Emma Watson gave a really good speech about this, a movement she is aiding called "He for She".
Albeit yes there are some feminists who do believe women should be the ALPHA in society but honestly I think that's very few feminists with very archaic perceptions of feminism.
At least nowadays, I feel that women aren't asking for a role reversal but for equality across the board.
Last edited by 832843 on 10 March 2015, 15:03, edited 1 time in total.
832843
 
Posts: 60
Joined: 19 February 2015, 14:56

Re: #Feminism

Unread postby Quoewlh » 10 March 2015, 07:30

This is why I don't like feminism:
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCMIj-w ... cLoBO2ciQQ

The guy basically debunks every issue that feminists claim to have and actually do that based on facts and evidence rather than "feelings" or invalid sources. If you want to associate yourself with equality, calling yourself humanist or egalitarianist would be more appropriate. There are just too many cases of feminism being on the extreme side of women rather than equality itself.
Image
Quoewlh
 
Posts: 203
+1s received: 4
Joined: 3 March 2015, 16:21
Country: Netherlands (nl)

Re: #Feminism

Unread postby Ciniselli » 10 March 2015, 08:57

There's a lot more than one feminism though - it's a very, very broad umbrella term for a number of different viewpoints.

Unfortunately, the kind of feminism that has become contagious on the internet is often laughable at best and extremely harmful at worst. There are a lot of people who throw around words like "patriarchy" or "slut-shaming" or "cultural appropriation" who will balk at the suggestion that feminist theory should be read (not simply spread) as thoughtfully as anything else in the academy.

As an example, I once had someone tell me that "tumblr has taught me about feminist ideas in a wsy that 6 years at university never could!" - i.e. the easy way, without any exertive effort like actually doing some reading or thinking about the concepts discussed by feminist academics.
Nonsense, I have not yet begun to defile myself.
User avatar
Ciniselli
 
Posts: 311
+1s received: 3
Joined: 8 March 2015, 16:17
Country: United Kingdom (gb)

Re: #Feminism

Unread postby Bro » 10 March 2015, 09:41

Just want to clear up some misconceptions about #Feminism.

There's a difference between a feminazi and a feminist.

A feminist is someone who supports womens' rights. Simple as that. Thinks girls in poorer countries should go to school, is opposed to those music videos that consist of like, three minutes of boob shots, etc. Equality is cool, guys. Feminism is cool.

A feminazi is not a feminist. Feminists believe in equal rights for us, feminazis just make us look stupid. Feminazis believe that all men are idiots, wearing a bra is a symbol of oppression (personally I find bras comfortable), shaving our legs is apparently showing that we GIVE INTO MALE PRESSURE TO BE ATTRACTIVE HOLY SHIT, snowmen must be called "snowpeople", and that any song that mentions a girl is supporting rape or whatever. Is apparently against sexism, making them a hugefuckinghypocrite.
Bro
 
Posts: 160
+1s received: 1
Joined: 30 October 2014, 09:51

Re: #Feminism

Unread postby Ciniselli » 10 March 2015, 09:57

I'm not sure the word "feminazi" is particularly helpful as nobody thinks they are a "feminazi". There is however a peculiarly Victorian strain of prudishness and language-policing in the more popular brand of "intersectional" feminism currently doing the rounds on the internet which is worth criticising and has almost become commonplace enough that it is not considered particularly extreme.

See these for more details (especially the second one, which is one of the most thoughtful things I've read on the internet in a long time):

http://www.vice.com/read/theres-a-new-p ... -i-hate-it

http://www.mcgilldaily.com/2014/11/ever ... oblematic/
Nonsense, I have not yet begun to defile myself.
User avatar
Ciniselli
 
Posts: 311
+1s received: 3
Joined: 8 March 2015, 16:17
Country: United Kingdom (gb)

Re: #Feminism

Unread postby Josh » 10 March 2015, 12:31

I would consider myself a supporter of feminism to a degree, but feel that by definition these days the whole idea of it is hugely outdated and flawed. The biggest problem with feminsm is people's failure to distinguish between feminism and equality - a damaging mistake to make.

Feminism should mean that you believe in gender equality, but feminism alone cannot achieve gender equality and that is where many (i.e. usually the most vocal) feminists stumble. Unfortunately the world isn't as straightforward as that, and inequality does not discriminate exclusively by gender. You can be treated unequally for your gender, yes, but also for your sexuality, your age, your financial status, your ethnicity, your appearance, your faith and a whole host of factors too numerous to count. Does this make the fight for equal rights for women irrelevant? No. But it makes it a cog in the machine towards equality, and not the machine itself. A black man is not treated the same as a white woman - by presumption he has gender on his side, whilst she has race on her side. Both will face problems within society, he may very well support gender equality whilst she may very well support racial equality. Feminism and equality are not mutually exclusive terms.

You hear buzzwords and terms like 'patriarchal society' thrown around a lot when it comes to talking about feminism. Many feminists have interpreted these terms to mean that men by default are already at an advantage within society on account of being men, the more elitist would have you believe that men are to be held accountable collectively for these issues. This is where feminism begins treading on shaky ground. Aside from the fact a man may face inequality on account of any of the aformentioned factors (an old, gay, black man with no savings is not equal to a heterosexual, young, financially secure white woman) he is also just as able to face problems within society because he is a man as well, and not all of those problems are because the society is patriarchal. Both genders come with problems, and it becomes all too easy to make sweeping generalisations about either gender - suggesting all men benefit from a patriarchal society is a sweeping generalisation, suggesting that all women are victims of one is a sweeping generalisation (and frankly a bit patronising towards women, in my opinion), suggesting that a man would benefit from supporting feminism to eradicate a patriarchal society is also a sweeping generalisation.

It is these generalisations that put feminism on shaky ground. They actually serve to stir up more inequality, also leaving some men more vulnerable in the process, and failing to bring improvements for women either. They reinforce an 'us and them' culture where gender is concerned, and equality of any kind was never achieved between 'us and them'. So whilst I have no problem with feminism, and obviously believe that equal gender rights are a must, I can't help but focus on the bigger picture...supporting feminism to a certain degree as part of a broader perspective that concerns all people.
Josh
 
Posts: 3456
+1s received: 28
Joined: 20 December 2012, 21:55
Location: London or Valencia
Country: United Kingdom (gb)

Re: #Feminism

Unread postby 832843 » 10 March 2015, 15:12

I guess people get wayyyy to caught up with the labels to really discover the true content of the message.
Yes I suppose the word "feminist/feminism" can put people off and that's usually based on pre-misconceptions.
A rose by any other name still smells as sweet right?
I mean albeit yes the message of feminism before was probably very anti-men and I understand why people are straight away turned off that label.
Things like labels change though in society.
I mean gay used to mean happy, now it means a sexual orientation, and annoyingly enough in a lot of colloquial settings means "stupid".

I don't know this for a fact but I feel in today's society it isn't anti-men any longer.
Sometimes I think people just need to see past the label and just hear out what the actual message is and then make a judgement based on what you hear, not just the 'title' of it.
Not that I know about or have taken any feminist studies so I could very well be wrong, but generally I think the world is becoming pro women.
You must admit though it wasn't like that in history so a name for the movement had to come from somewhere.

I don't think we'll rename women's rights to human rights, but essentially parts can overlap in terms of what they're trying to achieve.
Sometimes labels are just labels so you have a name to call something.
That's just my 2 cents.
832843
 
Posts: 60
Joined: 19 February 2015, 14:56

Re: #Feminism

Unread postby Josh » 10 March 2015, 16:08

NerdMonastery wrote:I don't think we'll rename women's rights to human rights, but essentially parts can overlap in terms of what they're trying to achieve.

And rightly so. :)
For as long as women are at some kind of disadvantage because of their gender, there should definitely be a fight for women's rights exclusively. I personally feel though that there needs to be less of a stigma regarding a man defending or taking pride in his gender.

International Women's Day is a perfect example of what I mean...

You get the droves of ignorant men who see that it's International Women's Day, and decide to ignorantly and moronically say/post online "well what about a International Men's Day then?!". They're so caught up in taking offence to a gender-specific celebration that they fail to realise that there is indeed a male equivalent (19th November, just in case anyone was wondering). So caught up in getting offended that they miss the point entirely.

But it doesn't stop there, because the retorts from women are no better either. Rather than responding maturely by pointing out that there's a men's day too, they instead decide to fuel the gender conflict by suggesting men don't need a marked day, or suggesting every other day of the year is "men's day", and that these men should shut up because feminism.

Ultimately everyone is missing the point, and again totally misinterpreting feminism and what it should stand for. Rather than simply taking pride in who we are and maintaining that mindset to treat everyone else equally around us, we're on red alert constantly to bring the 'not we' down a peg or two whenever we feel they've overstepped their mark. Feminism then becomes the source of so much conflict, again because of the 'us and them' culture that prevails each and every time.
Josh
 
Posts: 3456
+1s received: 28
Joined: 20 December 2012, 21:55
Location: London or Valencia
Country: United Kingdom (gb)

Re: #Feminism

Unread postby EleniDoSorto66 » 10 March 2015, 16:32

I believe we as a species are evolving into a more "androgynous" type of human, at least in the more developed countries. This is a great, beautiful and amazing thing because it has so much more advantages than us being pigeon-holed as strictly "masculine" or strictly "feminine" in the way we categorize ourselves and each other. What I mean when I mention this is that those who share both traits of what we'd define as such seem to have more health benefits; they live longer and have much more fulfilled and happy lives, as well as being more healthy to the community/society as well.

Granted there was a time when aggression, ego and self-image ("masculine" traits) did certainly play a huge role into shaping our cultures and civilizations - - greed and having to protect ones self being very fundamental to early society (duh!). So it'd make sense that a "patriarchal" (seems to be a no-no word here) society would have been the best route; now we're getting beyond that and can eventually, I feel, have a much more stable, giving, and nurturing as well as emotionally fulfilling culture/society ("feminine" traits) in the mixture as well.

Men and women are biologically different, therefore they're generally treated/raised up in a different manner; they're different as well as growing up and adopting certain behaviors/mentalities/identities because of this- - men are more self-centered, more ego-driven and more into their own image and drive for power - - partially due to competition and the ability to find a mate and reproduce. Women, however, are more nurturing, giving, involved in others and more emotionally intelligent/analytical than men - - this is because they're (generally) solely responsible for child rearing.

So, what it really all comes down to is SEX. And I firmly believe that we're still in a very early state of development when it comes to the human race as a whole; I.E women being far more exploited than men when it comes to sexuality/sexual needs and desires - - there is no way of cutting it. This is because men are also more sexually driven than women.

I do not know why everyone has to make "patriarchal" society seem like its an overblown word. You do realize that it IS the culture we live in (mostly because it is just a natural human trait) - - but it is also very detrimental to other men. There is a huge disadvantage to a lot of men; if women are personally "invaded" and told they must act/be/look a certain way, it is the same with men.

I think "feminazi" seems to be a harsh word; they're clearly a lot of valid arguments and ideas that those type of women hold. However, it does go too far when they're hating on the male gender. Unfortunately, haha, I think men make it just a little too easy at times.

"Feminists" I feel can share the same views as a "feminazi" and should not be condemned for it. I believe a true feminist should also empathize, support and raise men up as well.

Which all comes back to when I first mentioned us evolving into a more androgynous type of species; we're telling men that it is OK to show your emotions; it is OK to not have to confirm to societal expectations; it is OK to clean the fucking dishes once and a while and show much more "feminine" traits and you can still be a man. Feminism isn't just about women's rights, it is also about men's.
"'You're critical of everyone,' observes Iris.
'Oh, not everyone,' says Clara in an offhand manner. 'Only everybody who's alive as well as most people who are dead. I feel quite neutral about anybody not yet born.'"
User avatar
EleniDoSorto66
 
Posts: 419
+1s received: 80
Joined: 30 October 2013, 00:03
Country: United States (us)

Re: #Feminism

Unread postby Bro » 10 March 2015, 16:48

The media's representation of feminism, similar to how "wild-eyed swarthy terrorist" is the media representation of Islam.

A term which designates a fringe extremist who receives a lot of undeserved attention, and thus becomes the horrific, screeching spokesperson for an actually intelligent social cause.

A much-loved person by the media, who can give feminism a bad name, while distracting everyone from real feminist issues - like domestic abuse, rape, female genital mutilation, the feminization of poverty, etc.

Notably, man-hating is not synonymous with lesbianism. Woman-loving is synonymous with lesbianism. Be careful to not confuse the two, unless you're only heterosexual because you just can't stand your own gender.

Feminazis aren't necessarily lesbians, and vice versa.

Nor are feminazis true feminists.
That feminazi on the news is saying that we should change the word "world" to "womanorld!"

Video example of feminazis:

Bro
 
Posts: 160
+1s received: 1
Joined: 30 October 2014, 09:51

Re: #Feminism

Unread postby Bro » 10 March 2015, 16:54

TRUE DEFINITION OF #FEMINISM:

#Feminism
noun fem·i·nism \ˈfe-mə-ˌni-zəm\
: the belief that men and women should have equal rights and opportunities

: organized activity in support of women's rights and interests
Bro
 
Posts: 160
+1s received: 1
Joined: 30 October 2014, 09:51

Re: #Feminism

Unread postby waffles » 10 March 2015, 17:07

I am a strong disliker of the term feminism because it is a very female focus word, while equal rights are as much about women as they are about men. I would propose the word equalist, but the avatar franchise kind of ruined that already.

I agree that there are a lot of issues to be adressed and that women, certainly in third world countries, are often in a very weak position. That being said, I think giving fathers a paternal leave of the same length as the mother is feminism as well.

A lot of "issues" raised by femisist are exagerated in my opinion. Yes, female are portrayed as beautiful, slim and seductive, and this is not realistic. But nobody even dares to mention the fact that men are always half naked, infuential, muscular, well dressed, ... That's just as wrong in my opinion.
Image
User avatar
waffles
 
Posts: 306
+1s received: 1
Joined: 12 February 2015, 20:26
Location: Belgium
Country: Belgium (be)

Re: #Feminism

Unread postby Bro » 10 March 2015, 17:24

waffles wrote:I am a strong disliker of the term feminism because it is a very female focus word, while equal rights are as much about women as they are about men. I would propose the word equalist, but the avatar franchise kind of ruined that already.

I agree that there are a lot of issues to be adressed and that women, certainly in third world countries, are often in a very weak position. That being said, I think giving fathers a paternal leave of the same length as the mother is feminism as well.

A lot of "issues" raised by femisist are exagerated in my opinion. Yes, female are portrayed as beautiful, slim and seductive, and this is not realistic. But nobody even dares to mention the fact that men are always half naked, infuential, muscular, well dressed, ... That's just as wrong in my opinion.


How about Humanist:
a person having a strong interest in or concern for human welfare, values, and dignity.
Bro
 
Posts: 160
+1s received: 1
Joined: 30 October 2014, 09:51

Re: #Feminism

Unread postby Josh » 10 March 2015, 18:17

waffles wrote:I agree that there are a lot of issues to be adressed and that women, certainly in third world countries, are often in a very weak position. That being said, I think giving fathers a paternal leave of the same length as the mother is feminism as well.

A lot of "issues" raised by femisist are exagerated in my opinion. Yes, female are portrayed as beautiful, slim and seductive, and this is not realistic. But nobody even dares to mention the fact that men are always half naked, infuential, muscular, well dressed, ... That's just as wrong in my opinion.


You'd be surprised how much Africa is changing. Malawi, Senegal and Liberia are among the African countries with female leaders. The Rwandan Government is two-thirds female as well. That's not to say the women in power introduce more progressive policy than western counterparts but in terms of a gender issue the whole 'glass ceiling' is an evermore western concept.

When it comes to issues of vanity, I find there is a terrible double-standard where men fall victim. I recently went to a TV studio recording with a friend, and 50 Shades of Grey's Jamie Dornan was one of the guests. The women in the audience were literally reaching out and stroking him as he tried to film segments, they were calling out a range of sexualised comments as well. What I took from it is that not only were these women embarassing themselves and making the guy clearly a bit less than comfortable (as any man would be if he was groped by a 50-something cockney woman) but that it is apparently acceptable to act this way, whilst if that were a man doing the same to a woman everyone would go insane. Feminism has done a lot to protect and support women, but this whole equality thing has to work both ways and whilst the cause has my support, I'll speak up for men just as much.

As for a more gender-neutral term for equality...humanist works quite well, or...

Egalitarian: Belief in the equality of all people, especially in political, economic, or social life.
Josh
 
Posts: 3456
+1s received: 28
Joined: 20 December 2012, 21:55
Location: London or Valencia
Country: United Kingdom (gb)

Re: #Feminism

Unread postby poolerboy0077 » 11 March 2015, 07:18

So much stupid in this thread. Make the stupid stop. I beg you Jebus.
Blow: "Nowadays even Liam can release an album of his screechy vocals and it'll probably go #1..."
Ramzus: I can admit that I'm horny just about 24/7
homomorphism: I used to not think your name was deshay and that Erick was just being racist
Hunter: sometimes I think I was literally born to be a pornstar
User avatar
poolerboy0077
 
Posts: 7262
+1s received: 1428
Joined: 20 December 2012, 21:20
Country: United States (us)

Re: #Feminism

Unread postby xyz72 » 11 March 2015, 12:19

#FEMINISM? That's not how the English language works.
xyz72
 
Posts: 3923
+1s received: 28
Joined: 20 December 2012, 20:50
Country: Germany (de)

Re: #Feminism

Unread postby Bro » 11 March 2015, 12:45

xyz72 wrote:#FEMINISM? That's not how the English language works.



If you have nothing interesting to post on this thread, then just shut the heck up....
Bro
 
Posts: 160
+1s received: 1
Joined: 30 October 2014, 09:51

Re: #Feminism

Unread postby xyz72 » 11 March 2015, 12:49

Ethan wrote:
xyz72 wrote:#FEMINISM? That's not how the English language works.



If you have nothing interesting to post on this thread, then just shut the heck up....

So why do you have 27 posts, then?
xyz72
 
Posts: 3923
+1s received: 28
Joined: 20 December 2012, 20:50
Country: Germany (de)

Re: #Feminism

Unread postby Bro » 11 March 2015, 13:02

xyz72 wrote:
Ethan wrote:
xyz72 wrote:#FEMINISM? That's not how the English language works.



If you have nothing interesting to post on this thread, then just shut the heck up....

So why do you have 27 posts, then?



Because I post relevant posts unlike you, and I am not that active on the forums...Are those 1897 posts you made relevant enough or are they just spam?
Bro
 
Posts: 160
+1s received: 1
Joined: 30 October 2014, 09:51

Next

Recently active
Users browsing this forum: CommonCrawl [Bot], Courage, Fiulaposm, Severelius and 7 guests