Russia & Ukraine

Discuss the news, current events, politics, etc.

Do you think Russia will invade?

Yes
7
47%
Probably yes
2
13%
Maybe
2
13%
Probably no
3
20%
No
1
7%
Don't know/care or know what this even asking about
0
No votes
 
Total votes : 15

Re: Russia & Ukraine

Unread postby pozzie » 10 March 2022, 19:44

Yeah, I'm with you PopTart. I think the problem is the way the group works and now that (most) everyone lives their lives under the constant glare of the spotlight, and people check, it seems to affect a lot more than just "well, guess who I'm NOT inviting to the next dinner party."

What's with all the #MeToo pressure to hold men 'accused' of sexual harassment accountable via social media stigmatization? I think we're dealing with the same type of issue at play.
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Re: Russia & Ukraine

Unread postby PopTart » 10 March 2022, 20:26

Quite possibly. Bottom up pressure combined with top down pressure makes for a lot of squeezed people.

Anyone else noticed that, for all individual governments efforts to do financial harm to Russia, big business has managed to marshal a far more exacting response than any national government. Sure, I doubt Russia cares that Mothercare or IKEA have pulled out. I doubt McDonalds has the monopoly on grilled meat (or its susbtitutes) between soggy bread. But the volume of western businesses that, without much prompting from governments, have pulled out, sometimes at great expense is surprising.

I can't help bit be cynical as to their motivations, no matter how many billions of dollars they sacrifice in doing so.
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Re: Russia & Ukraine

Unread postby pozzie » 10 March 2022, 20:41

Well, the Russians are readying their reply to such corporations and basically all states but a handful. They call it 'economic war' and are basically preparing to nationalize any assests 'left behind'. While I can't get to the InterFax website, for instance, planes leased by Russian airlines don't have to be returned unless the Russian government tells them to and lease payments can be made in rubles. Patent theft is no longer a crime if patent is held by an "unfriendly state". And draft legislation to nationalize/auction any assets left behind is in the works. I'm guessing this will be hitting the western financial press soon if it hasn't already.

So, there will be plenty of tax right offs to come!
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Re: Russia & Ukraine

Unread postby Brenden » 12 March 2022, 13:57

PopTart wrote:Quite possibly. Bottom up pressure combined with top down pressure makes for a lot of squeezed people.

Anyone else noticed that, for all individual governments efforts to do financial harm to Russia, big business has managed to marshal a far more exacting response than any national government. Sure, I doubt Russia cares that Mothercare or IKEA have pulled out. I doubt McDonalds has the monopoly on grilled meat (or its susbtitutes) between soggy bread. But the volume of western businesses that, without much prompting from governments, have pulled out, sometimes at great expense is surprising.

I can't help bit be cynical as to their motivations, no matter how many billions of dollars they sacrifice in doing so.

They're doing it because of the government sanctions, which make it neigh-impossible to continue profitable operations. They're just spinning it as making the decisions out of the goodness of their legal-fiction hearts so they can look good to the public.
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Re: Russia & Ukraine

Unread postby PopTart » 12 March 2022, 20:28

Brenden wrote:
PopTart wrote:Quite possibly. Bottom up pressure combined with top down pressure makes for a lot of squeezed people.

Anyone else noticed that, for all individual governments efforts to do financial harm to Russia, big business has managed to marshal a far more exacting response than any national government. Sure, I doubt Russia cares that Mothercare or IKEA have pulled out. I doubt McDonalds has the monopoly on grilled meat (or its susbtitutes) between soggy bread. But the volume of western businesses that, without much prompting from governments, have pulled out, sometimes at great expense is surprising.

I can't help bit be cynical as to their motivations, no matter how many billions of dollars they sacrifice in doing so.

They're doing it because of the government sanctions, which make it neigh-impossible to continue profitable operations. They're just spinning it as making the decisions out of the goodness of their legal-fiction hearts so they can look good to the public.

I hear what your saying. I'm just not entirely convinced. I don't believe for a second that businesses actually care, they are incapable. But many businesses are going above and beyond the requirements of the sanctions. Many going as far as pulling out entirely as a symbolic gesture that is indicative of modern businesses taking moral stances, primarly based on the percieved attitudes of their wider consumer base.

That the sanctions imposed on individuals, by national governments, are being dwarfed by the sanctions being imposed by businesses and corporations, speaks to something I feel.
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