Why do most gays vote democrat?

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Re: Why do most gays vote democrat?

Unread postby Derek » 23 March 2020, 19:52

Rym2018 wrote:The philosophy behind small government is the idea that the government’s duty to it citizens is to protect their life, liberty and property. Thus, any action of mine that harms others may be regulated by the government. So during a pandemic, if by the simple fact of going outside may put other people’s life in danger, a temporary quarantine order may be appropriate.

Either way, you're ceding the point that government intervention can benefit society. If it's appropriate to safeguard the common good in some cases, why not in others? Our society is filled with bad actors and exploitative systems, and drawing the line at "life, liberty and property" is a lazy attempt to disengage with that reality.

Now, to be philosophical consistent, where I think Civil rights went too far was where it banned discrimination by private people. Nonetheless, it only banned discrimination on the basis of race, color, religion, sex or national origin. I can live with that.

That's the quintessential libertarian. Yes, these policies improved people's lives and helped ameliorate social injustices. No, I don't think they were a good idea.
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Re: Why do most gays vote democrat?

Unread postby Courage » 26 March 2020, 05:17

Rym2018 wrote:Shouldn’t the small government “stay out of my business” ideology of the republican party be more appealing for gays?

Lol you're kidding right? Republicans only want small government when it benefits their lobbyists with stocks in multi-million dollar industries. They voted against revoking tax credits for businesses that send labor overseas. They pass legislation that encourages monopolies. They want the government to intervene and criminalize gay marriage, abortion, etc.


Republicans are not anti-government, they're anti-everything but themselves.
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Re: Why do most gays vote democrat?

Unread postby poolerboy0077 » Yesterday, 04:45

You know Derek, as Saul Berenson from Homeland once put it, you’re the smartest fucking person and the dumbest fucking person I’ve ever met. If you had played your cards right, you’d be rich off stupid schmucks watching your Ben Shapiro-esque YouTube videos “DESTROYING” your interlocutors with “FACTS” and “LOGIC” but instead you’re here, responding to dumbasses for free while weathering these worldwide economic and biological storms. You’re only beaten by Hunter who gives up his prime real estate body to dirty old German men in exchange for attention.
Blow: "Nowadays even Liam can release an album of his screechy vocals and it'll probably go #1..."
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Re: Why do most gays vote democrat?

Unread postby Derek » Yesterday, 05:15

In this metaphor, Hunter represents the white race, you're the liberal he's cucking, the gross old Germans are multiculturalism, and I'm the weeping Statue of Liberty from conservative cartoons.
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Re: Why do most gays vote democrat?

Unread postby poolerboy0077 » Yesterday, 13:46

:lol:


:cry:
Blow: "Nowadays even Liam can release an album of his screechy vocals and it'll probably go #1..."
Ramzus: I can admit that I'm horny just about 24/7
homomorphism: I used to not think your name was deshay and that Erick was just being racist
Hunter: sometimes I think I was literally born to be a pornstar
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Re: Why do most gays vote democrat?

Unread postby Magic J » Yesterday, 19:56

poolerboy0077 wrote:If you had played your cards right, you’d be rich off stupid schmucks watching your Ben Shapiro-esque YouTube videos “DESTROYING” your interlocutors with “FACTS” and “LOGIC” but instead you’re here, responding to dumbasses for free while weathering these worldwide economic and biological storms.

I surprisingly had some success in convincing someone who'd gone deep down into Shapiro worship that he's a total fraud. Blindsided them by arguing that: even if we assume for the sake of argument that his ideas have some merit (they generally don't, but bear with me), his whole shtick is completely in bad faith. He supposedly wants to reach the Truth through rigorous application of LOGIC, but has an argumentative style with clearly suggests he's more interested in self-aggrandising and political grandstanding. He browbeats people with that weird, rapid fire tirade he does, and seems to have no intention of considering any other point of view to his own. Worse, he is supposedly concerned about the partisan tone of debate these days, and yet perpetuates it to a ridiculous degree, knowingly in my opinion. Also all the stupid, childish comments he makes on issues of race and the Israel Palestine conflict, but I was focusing on debating style. :P

Maybe I'm just too in love with the dialectical approach to argument, but it seems to work if everybody's willing. He doesn't do that. He's too in love with himself to ever think that anybody else could possibly disagree with him, and disagree with him firmly within the parameters of the logic he thinks himself an exemplar of.

God, he fucking irks me. I'm leaving this here because it makes me smile.



Soz for the ream of bile. Back to libertarianism, cake, and the intersections between them. :P
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Re: Why do most gays vote democrat?

Unread postby Derek » Today, 05:43

Anyone who makes their living as a conservative intellectual has to spend their life convincing themselves over and over that people deserve to suffer and it's pointless to work towards a better future. I have to imagine it rots you from in the inside out.

Point is, don't worry about Ben Shapiro, I'm sure he's suffering enough. Like, imagine spending the whole early part of your career defending the moral atrocities of the Iraq War, and then denouncing Trump when he comes along because he's so boorish and uncouth, and then he wins and you and the rest of the vampires who sold their souls to neoconservativism get called cucks and soy boys by people who are just one bad day away from banning Jews from their country clubs.
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Re: Why do most gays vote democrat?

Unread postby Severelius » Today, 10:41

It depresses me that I have friends who genuinely think Ben Shapiro is some kind of intellectual powerhouse.
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Re: Why do most gays vote democrat?

Unread postby Magic J » Today, 14:22

I usually try to explicit consider the new conservatism as distinct from old conservatism. I've read some philosophers and political theorists that are pretty conservative in outlook, and they have interesting perspectives on institutions, community, pessimism, religion, the nation, conservation, and capitalism (hell, there's plenty conservative critics of capitalism). I doubtlessly won't agree much, but I can imagine talking to them pretty easily, and would welcome doing so. There's things to learn from conservatism: for instance, that one should be wary of abstract political plans that don't take into account real people and real human behaviour. I don't see it as totally intellectually bankrupt.

But the current field of popular conservative "intellectuals"? Pretty barren, as you say. In the final stage of selling their souls to a rabid form of right populism, which, if I wanted to put forward a High Tory critique, is most unbecoming. :P The Spectator used to be a pretty good read, I hear; now it's just a slightly more urbane version of the Daily Mail.

Traditional High Conservatism ranks a little bit lower on the "Things I Disagree With" scale than Neoconservatism/Right Quasi-Libertarianism, is what I'm saying. :P Which might be a bit weird, since I've quite liberal instincts, but Neoconservatism is 1) the more dominant ideology, and 2) seems to attract racists, for some reason.
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Re: Why do most gays vote democrat?

Unread postby Derek » 48 minutes ago

Magic J wrote:But the current field of popular conservative "intellectuals"? Pretty barren, as you say.

That's not how I see it. The familiar "intellectual conservativism" we all know and love is the Buckleyesque kind of navel-gazey imperialism that jerks off on the pages of Burke's Reflections but is so fundamentally dishonest that they can't even admit to themselves that racism is the glue that holds it all together. The populist strain is, at the very least, honest. They don't have to effect that prissy elitist aesthetic to articulate the same goals.

Ben Shapiro is a great example of that. He came to work at Breitbart, a publications whose purpose is to stoke racial resentment in its white audience, and was only forced out when the simmering antisemitism reached a full boil, and he then proceeded to lament the death of the "proud intellectual traditions" that Breitbart himself once championed. It's a disgusting spectacle, but a clarifying one.
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Re: Why do most gays vote democrat?

Unread postby Severelius » 42 minutes ago

In the post-Tea Party world, the era of Donald Trump and Boris Johnson, I find the term 'intellectual conservatism' to be a fundamental oxymoron.
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